L'Inceste en islam, Ok ?

Etude de l'islam via les hadiths et le coran
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L'Inceste en islam, Ok ?

Nouveau messagede Morpheus » 4 Mar 2013 02

THE AUTHORIZATION OF INCEST IN ISLAM

The truth about Islam has been one of the world’s best-kept secrets. For centuries, it has been practically impossible to raise objections about Islam or the character of Muhammad in Muslim countries. Anyone who raises any objections against Islam would place his or her life in great danger. But things have changed. With the advent of the Internet, it is now impossible for Muslims to keep the dark teachings of Islam a secret. Many people are now aware of the true teachings of Islam, and Muslims are unable to silence everyone.

There are many dishonorable teachings in Islam, but for the moment we will discuss two such teachings. One is Incest and the other is a form of marriage known as Hilla Marriage or Nikah Hilla. Please read this article very carefully and be prepared for some shocking revelation.

Incest is defined as sexual relations between persons who are so closely related that their marriage is illegal or forbidden by custom. The prohibition of incest is and has been one of the most common of all cultural taboos, both currently and in the past. However, in some specific instances, incest is permitted in Islam and is not considered a sin in its theology. There is a religious ruling that is taught and upheld by prominent Islamic scholars. This religious ruling reveals the approval of incest within its theology. The approval of this extremely debased practice serves as a character witness of the religion of Islam. In accordance with the most authentic teaching of Islam, a Muslim man is permitted to marry his own biological daughter and consummate the marriage with her if she was conceived illegitimately. The foundation for incest in Islam is laid in the following verse:

Surah 25:54: It is He Who has created man from water: then has He established relationships of lineage and marriage: for thy Lord has power over all things. (Yusuf Ali)

Al-Qurtubi is one of Islam’s premiere commentators. In his commentary (tafsir) on Surah 25:54, he quotes Ibn Al-Arabi (1165 C.E. – 1240 C.E.), the most influential author of Islamic history, known to his supporters as al-Shaykh al-akbar, “the Greatest Master.” Al-Qurtubi wrote:

Regarding the terms “lineage and relationship through marriage”:

“Lineage and relationship through marriage are two terms that describe the personal relationships that may exist between humans. Ibn Al-Arabi said, “Lineage is an expression referring to the mixture of fluids between a male and a female from a religious legal point of view. However, if this union (between male and female) occurs through disobedience (fornication) then the resulting child is not considered a part of a person’s true lineage. That is why a daughter born from adultery is not mentioned in Allah’s saying, ‘Prohibited to you (for marriage) are: your mothers and daughters’ (Surah 4:23) because she is not considered a daughter according to the most authentic teaching of our (Islamic) scholars and the most authentic teaching of our religion. If there is no legal lineage then there is no legal relationship; for adultery does not prohibit (from marriage) the daughter of the mother (you committed adultery with) nor the mother of a woman (you committed adultery with). What is lawfully prohibited is not also prohibited due to sin, for Allah has bestowed lineage and relation through marriage upon His servants and greatly esteemed these relationships. Allah has also established laws identifying what is legal and what is prohibited, which are not equal to each other; therefore falsehood cannot be a part of these laws.” (Tafseer Qurtubi, Surah 25 verse 54; Translated from Al-Azhar’s official website).

Let us analyze this Islamic ruling very carefully. According to this Islamic ruling, a daughter born out of wedlock is not considered as the daughter of the man. Therefore, it becomes permissible for him to marry her. The above Islamic ruling clearly states, “…the resulting child is not considered a part of a person’s true lineage.” Thus, the daughter is regarded the same as any other unrelated woman. As such, Islam does not prohibit the marriage between the father and daughter who is born through fornication or adultery (out of wedlock). And the above Islamic ruling also adds that according to “the most authentic teaching of Islam, if there is no legal lineage then there is no legal relationship; for adultery does not prohibit from marriage the daughter of the mother you committed adultery with.” And to drive home the point, the ruling states, “What is lawfully prohibited is not also prohibited due to sin, for Allah has bestowed lineage and relation through marriage.” In others words, while it is prohibited to marry one’s own daughter who is conceived in marriage, it is not prohibited in Islam to marry one’s own daughter if she is conceived out of wedlock.

According to Islam’s logic, it is like saying that it is wrong to drive recklessly and harm others only when we possess a valid driving license. However, if we do not possess a driving license, then it is perfectly all right to drive dangerously and injure others. Not having a driving license, somehow justifies our driving dangerously. Similarly, not having a legal marital status (marriage license) somehow justifies incest. How can one illegal act (adultery) make another illegal act (incest) lawful? How can the sin of adultery nullify the sin of incest and make it an acceptable act? Can two wrongs (adultery and incest) make a right? The second wrong that is permitted with the blessing of Allah is incest between a father and his daughter. How does having a daughter from an adulterous relationship make her sexually permissible for the father when she is in every sense his very own flesh and blood? No matter how she is conceived, she still remains his biological child and should be sexually off limits to him. This is a gross violation of the divine standard of morality. Just think, will the true God permit incest knowingly? We will now consider Al-Qurtubi’s exegesis on Surah 4:23:

Surah 4:23: “Prohibited to you (for marriage) are: your mothers, daughters, sisters; father's sisters, mother's sisters; brother's daughters, sister's daughters; foster-mothers (who gave you suck), foster-sisters; your wives' mothers; your step-daughters under your guardianship, born of your wives to whom ye have gone, no prohibition if ye have not gone in; (those who have been) wives of your sons proceeding from your loins; and two sisters in wedlock at one and the same time, except for what is past; for Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.” (Yusuf Ali)

The scholars have differed on the issue of prohibition of sexual intercourse with someone born out of adultery. The majority of knowledgeable scholars have said that if a man commits adultery with a woman, that act does not prohibit him from marrying her. Likewise, a man’s wife is not prohibited from him if he commits adultery with her mother or her daughter. It is sufficient for him to receive the punitive judgment (based on Sharia), then he may have intercourse with his wife. If a man commits adultery with a woman then desired to marry her mother or her daughter, they are not prohibited from him because of this act.

Another group said (such a marriage) is prohibited for him. This opinion was reported by Amran Ibn Husain, as well as Al-Shu’bi and Atta’, Al Hassan, Sufyan Al–Thuri, Ahmad, Ishaq and those of opinion. It was reported by Malik that adultery prohibits (a man’s relationship with both) the mother and the daughter and this act (of adultery) has the same prohibitions that a legal marriage has. This is also the saying of the people of Iraq. However, the (only) correct portion of Malik’s saying is that adultery produces no regulations. For Allah, exalted and glorified, said in Surah 4:23, "Your wives' mothers," but did not say, "He who committed adultery with his wives’ mothers, nor his daughter whom he conceived through adultery." This is the saying of Al-Shafi’i and Abu Thuri…

… Abdul Malik Ibn Al-Maj-shun said such a marriage (between a man and the daughter he conceived through adultery) is permissible; which is the correct understanding of Allah’s saying in Surah 25:54, "It is He Who has created man from water: then has He established relationships of lineage and marriage," referring to an approved legal marriage. This will be explained in Surah 25…” (Tafsir al-Qurtubi, Translated from the official website of Saudi Arabia, Ministry of Islamic Affairs).

The reason for these Islamic scholars to so strongly uphold a practice that is morally and ethically wrong is primarily because of the Qur’an’s insistence that lineage and relationship are only recognized through “legal marriage.”

An added reason why these scholars could condone such a perverted view, to the extent of even accepting incest, is mainly because of the Qur’an’s insufficiency to provide specific details on a given subject. Note again the commentary by al-Qurtubi on Surah 4:23:

For Allah, exalted and glorified, said in Surah 4:23, “Your wives' mothers,” But did not say, “He who committed adultery with his wives’ mothers, nor his daughter whom he conceived through adultery.”

Since Allah does not recognize the lineage of the daughter and he did not specifically forbid this form of incestuous marriage, a man’s daughter becomes permissible to him if he is not married to her mother at the time of her conception – even though the child is his biological daughter, his own flesh and blood. Another scholar of Islam also confirms this judicial ruling. Al-Fiqh Ala al Madahib al Arba'a by Sheikh Abdurehman Jazri, Volume 4, page 40:

“It is permissible for a man to marry his daughter who is born through adultery.”

“The one (girl) who is born through adultery does not become mahram (to her father) as the Shafiee say, because she is not considered as daughter since there is no inheritance between them.”


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Re: L'Inceste en islam, Ok !

Nouveau messagede Morpheus » 4 Mar 2013 15

Je resume en francais :


Si et seulement Si, sa fille est issu d un adultere, alors son pere biologique peut avoir des relations avec sa fille.

C est ce qu explique le Sheikh Abdurehman Jazri, Volume 4, page 40 ; La fille d un adultere n est pas reconnu sa fille legitime (par la charia), car l union est illegale
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Re: L'Inceste en islam, Ok !

Nouveau messagede groove19 » 4 Mar 2013 18

Morpheus a écrit:Je resume en francais :


Si et seulement Si, sa fille est issu d un adultere, alors son pere biologique peut avoir des relations avec sa fille.

C est ce qu explique le Sheikh Abdurehman Jazri, Volume 4, page 40 ; La fille d un adultere n est pas reconnu sa fille legitime (par la charia), car l union est illegale


Euh enfin ton roman en anglais pour me traduire que 2 Lignes a la sauce Made in morpheus tu repassera la prochaine fois (ici c'est du sérieux,surtout dans des sujets comme sa )!

Maintenant tu et en train de me dire que imaginons que j'ai une fille en dehors de ma Femme mais avec ma maitresse il est Halal pour moi d'avoir des relation avec x08

C'est sa que tu et en train de nous expliquer ??????????????????????

Car si c'est sa il te faudra expliquer ce que dit le Coran dans :
Sourate Al-Nissa (Les femmes) 4 V 22-23

22*/وَلا تَنكِحوا ما نَكَحَ ءاباؤُكُم مِنَ النِّساءِ إِلّا ما قَد سَلَفَ ۚ إِنَّهُ كانَ فٰحِشَةً وَمَقتًا وَساءَ سَبيلًا

Et n´épousez pas les femmes que vos pères ont épousées, exception faite pour le passé. C´est une turpitude, une abomination , et quelle mauvaise conduite !

23*/حُرِّمَت عَلَيكُم أُمَّهٰتُكُم وَبَناتُكُم وَأَخَوٰتُكُم وَعَمّٰتُكُم وَخٰلٰتُكُم وَبَناتُ الأَخِ وَبَناتُ الأُختِ وَأُمَّهٰتُكُمُ الّٰتى أَرضَعنَكُم وَأَخَوٰتُكُم مِنَ الرَّضٰعَةِ وَأُمَّهٰتُ نِسائِكُم وَرَبٰئِبُكُمُ الّٰتى فى حُجورِكُم مِن نِسائِكُمُ الّٰتى دَخَلتُم بِهِنَّ فَإِن لَم تَكونوا دَخَلتُم بِهِنَّ فَلا جُناحَ عَلَيكُم وَحَلٰئِلُ أَبنائِكُمُ الَّذينَ مِن أَصلٰبِكُم وَأَن تَجمَعوا بَينَ الأُختَينِ إِلّا ما قَد سَلَفَ ۗ إِنَّ اللَّهَ كانَ غَفورًا رَحيمًا

Vous sont interdites vos mères, filles, sœurs, tantes paternelles et tantes maternelles, filles d´un frère et filles d´une sœur, mères qui vous ont allaités, sœurs de lait, mères de vos femmes,belles-filles sous votre tutelleet issues des femmes avec qui vous avez consommé le mariage; si le mariage n´a pas été consommé, ceci n´est pas un péché de votre part; les femmes de vos fils nés de vos reins; de même que deux sœurs réunies - exception faite pour le passé. Car vraiment Allah est Pardonneur et Miséricordieux;

Bon juge en toi même, si déjà sœurs de lait ces Haram sa veux tout dire, car les Filles et pas né des reins de ton père et juste parce quel a partager le lait maternelle de mère respectif elle deviens de ce fait ta sœur et Haram au mariage !

Ensuite belles filles sur votre tutelle KIF KIF !

Mais plus simplement on t'enseigne dans le verset 23 te dit clairement VOS FILLES x17

Le Coran est la vérité déjà que la fornication est haram tout cours hors maraige Halal alors avoir des relation avec ta propre fille issue de tes reins euh sérieux morpheus ferme ton Topic tout pourri de ton Forum qui commence a le devenir x13

ps; Je bien intervenir sur des Topics ou il y a matière a débattre mais la sérieux tu commence a agir comme un Gamin qui s'acharne dans le mensonge, tu invente, tu et un menteur par dessus tout ...

Oui je le répète tu et un menteur dans l'âme .
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Re: L'Inceste en islam, Ok !

Nouveau messagede Lemur22 » 4 Mar 2013 18

Bonsoir Groove.

Que penses-tu de cela :

"Il (l'enfant adultérin) doit être obéissant et bienfaisant envers sa mère qui a sur lui des droits similaires aux droits de toutes les mères sur leurs enfants. Quant au fornicateur qui a commis avec elle le péché, il n’est pas son père légal et de ce fait les rapports que doit entreprendre le fils avec son père légal ne s’appliquent pas à lui.

Donc on peut penser qu'un homme peut avoir des relations sexuelles avec sa fille adultérine qui n'est pas reconnu comme sa fille ?
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Re: L'Inceste en islam, Ok !

Nouveau messagede groove19 » 4 Mar 2013 21

Lemur22 a écrit:Bonsoir Groove.

Que penses-tu de cela :

"Il (l'enfant adultérin) doit être obéissant et bienfaisant envers sa mère qui a sur lui des droits similaires aux droits de toutes les mères sur leurs enfants. Quant au fornicateur qui a commis avec elle le péché, il n’est pas son père légal et de ce fait les rapports que doit entreprendre le fils avec son père légal ne s’appliquent pas à lui.

Donc on peut penser qu'un homme peut avoir des relations sexuelles avec sa fille adultérine qui n'est pas reconnu comme sa fille ?


Bonsoir Lemur

Je comprend pas ce que vous voulais dire ??
Personne parle très clairement !

Explique moi en faite et dit moi si j'ai bien saisi l'histoire !
En faite tu parle d'un homme qui as des rapports avec la fille de sa Femme quel a eu dans l'adultère ????
Autrement dit le père (tuteur en quelque sorte) n'est pas le père de la fille issue de ses reins ???

Il est important qu'on m'explique la situation,projeter vous en me donnant des exemple sur vous en l’imaginant bien sur afin de donner une vison de la chose !

Suite a cela je répondrai sans déroute et très simplement x16

ps: En attendant un homme qui as des rapports en dehors de sa femme et Haram, le mariage et une institution clair et prècise ,son organisation y voie la remise de la dot et plein d'autre chose.

Un père ou un homme n'as strictement pas le droit d'avoir des rapports dans la chambre de la fillette des qu'un coup de chaleur lui frappe le bas ventre ... x16
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Re: L'Inceste en islam, Ok !

Nouveau messagede groove19 » 4 Mar 2013 22

EDIT morpheus


Eh OH il y a quelqu'un !!! x08

morpheus est ce que la fille est la fille de sang ,autrement dit est ce la fille issue des reins du père ou juste la fille de la mère quel a eu avec un adultère ???

Répond simplement on est pas a l’université du bétar

ps: Le verset 23 interdit la belle fille sous votre tutelle x18
groove19
 

Re: L'Inceste en islam, Ok !

Nouveau messagede Morpheus » 5 Mar 2013 15

groove

je veux bien admettre que ce sujet n est pas aussi clair que la necrophilie et profanation de tombe clairement etablies dans les hadiths. c est pourquoi je vais mettre un point d interrogation au titre
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Re: L'Inceste en islam, Ok !

Nouveau messagede groove19 » 5 Mar 2013 17

Morpheus a écrit:groove

je veux bien admettre que ce sujet n est pas aussi clair que la necrophilie et profanation de tombe clairement etablies dans les hadiths. c est pourquoi je vais mettre un point d interrogation au titre


Wouah super j'en demander pas autant, un point d'interrogation x08

Tu n'as pas le choix car mes réponses sont clair ,les versets que je tes citais ferme la boucle de ton topic de propagande qui a pour but juste un état d'esprit provocateur de ta part !

ps; Euh petite appartè tu repassera pour tes hadiths établies concernant la nécrophilie et profanation des tombes car tout ce que tu as rèussi a nous mettre comme preuves et une accusations sur le Prophète alors qu'il avais une tripoter de Compagnons sur place ,et concernant le nécrophilie un vieux Imam d'un village isolé ou un imam inconnue a fais le Buzz car il a parlait dans une Radio local ou tout le monde lui a rie au nez x21

Maos concernant le Coran qui doit donner le droit logiquement a tes accusations makèche Wallo x18
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Re: L'Inceste en islam, Ok ?

Nouveau messagede Morpheus » 5 Mar 2013 20

je suis honnete groove, sur ce sujet je vais mettre le benefice du doute, mais sur les autres tu connais mon point de vue ;)
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Re: L'Inceste en islam, Ok ?

Nouveau messagede groove19 » 5 Mar 2013 21

Morpheus a écrit:je suis honnete groove, sur ce sujet je vais mettre le benefice du doute, mais sur les autres tu connais mon point de vue ;)


Mais dans ce cas la je te fèlicite et te dit c'est tout a ton honneur ,'en demande pas plus ,juste savoir reconnaitre quand on est pas sur, et tu verra je serai aussi humble que toi et oublierai les vannes que je donne a contre coeur

ps; Tu vais pas fais un point d’exclamations tout a l'heure ou j'ai rêver x16
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